What began as a seemingly innocent childhood accident involving fire and gasoline tragically became the pivotal catalyst for a remarkable journey of resilience, unwavering spirit, and profound life lessons he has since embraced and shared with the world. Today, we sit down with John O’Leary, whose life took an unexpected turn at just nine years old. His story, now a Sony Pictures film titled Soul on Fire, is a powerful testament to the choices we make in the face of adversity. John generously shares his firsthand experiences, offering an intimate glimpse into the moments that shaped him and the wisdom he has gathered on leadership, faith, and the eternal things that truly matter.
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Soul On Fire With John O’Leary
I’m with my friend John O’Leary, who’s in Missouri, in the middle of the country. John is married to his wife, Beth. They have four children. He owns a business that has taken him all over the world, doing something he loves. In the timeframe when he was nine years old, he had something happen that altered his life trajectory very significantly.
John, your story has leadership lessons. We’re going to talk about that. Welcome to the show.
I have been on this little podcast tour, and not one of them has introduced me as their friend. We became friends by the end of the 10 minutes or the 60 minutes, whatever it was. You used that word, and you used it sincerely. I’m honored to be on with my friend. I love the work you do. I’m honored to serve your people.
Thanks. We’re going to have a great conversation. It’s a little bit uncanny where it’s going to come from. Maybe people thought your business died, and that was your trauma, or maybe they thought you had a family issue, and that was your trauma, but your trauma was quite a bit more than the average person experienced or will experience. Why don’t you share with us what happened in the garage at your home when you were nine years old that you didn’t expect?
The Garage Accident & Immediate Aftermath
I will. I’m going to begin by saying I never expected anything positive could have ever come out of this. It is impossible for something beautiful to come out of what we’re about to talk about. Yet, God shows up again and again, not only in my story and our experiences, but in our collective experiences throughout life. To answer your question, about a week before this event, I was watching in my backyard these kids behind me playing with fire and gasoline. What they would do is strike a match and throw it into a little puddle of gasoline, and they would dance to life. I assumed, “If they can do it and get away with it, so can I.”
On a Saturday morning, my father was at work. He was a small business owner. My mother was out with a couple of my sisters. The house was all mine. I made my way into the garage, bent over a can of gasoline, and lit a piece of cardboard. I bear-hugged this container and tilted it toward that cardboard, waiting for the liquid to come out as I’d seen kids doing.
Before I even tell you what happens, most of your readers have a sense. It’s also important not to judge what’s about to happen and think, “They’re talking about a fire story.” I’m talking about a leadership story here. That’s what we’re talking about. We become like the voices we pay attention to. We become like the people with whom we party, who we sit next to, who we die with, and who we read from. Choose wisely. Convene does this better than any other organization I’m familiar with. It guides us forward appropriately. Be aware. We become like the voices we give attention to.
As important leaders, others are looking up to you as an example. There’s some kid looking over the hillside at what you’re doing. Give them something that is worthy of being modeled in a marketplace that rarely will. That weekend, my parents are gone, and I’m over this can. Before the liquid comes out, the fumes come out. It creates this massive explosion. It split the metal can in 2, picked up the 9-year-old boy, and launched me 20 feet against the far side of the garage. That’s the starting point of this wild story.
You bring up an incredible point, which is that we can be shocked by the enormity of that story. It was cardboard, a match, and a can of gasoline. Maybe somebody’s reading who thought, “If I buy this stock, if I start this company like this, if I hire this person, or if I do this thing, everything will be fun,” and it turned out it wasn’t so fun. You spent five months in the hospital after that moment. You endured dozens of surgeries and underwent years of physical therapy. What were you thinking as a 9 or maybe then became a 10-year-old during that time?
Hospitalization & His Father’s Love
I’ll play the micro and the macro. I was eventually rushed to the hospital and was lying on a hospital bed, surrounded by staff. I never met any of them. I’d never been in a hospital bed before, not once. The only thought going through my mind as a child was, “My dad is going to kill me when he finds out.” I knew my father’s wrath was coming to finish me off. That’s what I was focused on as I heard his voice down the hall, yelling at some nurse, “Where’s my boy John?”
She brings him back into the room. This fellow executive pulls back the curtain, marches in as he learned in the Army, points down, and says to me, “John, look at me when I’m talking to you.” I looked up, and my father said, “I have never been so proud of anyone in my entire life, my little buddy. This morning, I’m simply glad to be your dad.” Then, my father says, “I love you. There’s nothing you can do about it.” You’re saying, “Wow.” I remember not saying, “Wow.” I was saying to myself, “Nobody told my dad what happened. Clearly, this man does not know I burned down his house.”
Over to my right in my office, there’s a picture of the Prodigal Son. It’s a knockoff, but it’s the Rembrandt cheap, knockoff painting. It’s this picture of this big old royal garb dad putting both of his big old meaty arms around his son, bringing him back, and loving him forward. To me, that signifies not only what I long for in my dad. I’m not talking about my Earthly one. I’m talking about God, our Father. I need that grace because I’m a trainwreck so often.
It’s also what I experienced as a nine-year-old boy from my Earthly father. I did everything in the world to mess it up. I burned down the family home and burned myself. I should have died, but my dad comes marching into this room filled with mercy, grace, and love. That did not make the next five and a half months in the hospital easy. What does? His love in moment one of day one made the journey possible.
The way we walk into a room changes that room. My dad walked in as the embodiment of Christ. It changed me, and it changed those who are witnessing this love. That’s what love does. It doesn’t just change the two who are engaged. It changed everybody else who was watching. That’s what I was thinking in the micro. I was like, “My dad’s going to kill me.”
I was never going to be defined by my scars. Share on XIn the longer sense, during that time and during that season, what I was thinking is, “If and when I get out, I will not be defined by this thing. I will not be scarred for the rest of my life. I will not be broken, battered, and beaten. I will prove to this ugly world and this ugly reflection that I’m enough.” A child made a commitment to never look back, which sounds healthy, and there’s some wisdom in that, but if you don’t look back, you also don’t learn. I never looked back. I kept moving forward and racing up the ladder. We can talk later on about what eventually changed, but I was never going to be defined by my scars.
Commitment To Not Be Defined By Scars
It’s incredible to think that at 9 and/or 10 years old, you were thinking that deeply. That’s phenomenal. Where did that come from? Was it Mom and Dad’s training?
Probably partially. I also think it came from a kid who was athletic, popular, funny, and was going to play shortstop for the St. Louis Cardinals, recognizing that all those things might have been taken away from him. My desire to still achieve, be known, be loved, and be seen could not be. I thought I could still become something in my life in spite of what I’d endured. Part of it was the training and the reckoning that my mother gave me on things like, “You can play the piano. You can write again,” but part of it was doggone determination to hide the scars.
In the more macro version, my belief system was that I would not be defined by this tragedy. I wanted to step away from the shadow of a kid in a wheelchair without fingers and without skin on the majority of his body. I’m scarred from my neck to my toes. My goal in life, as I came out of the hospital, was that I would not be defined by being a burn survivor.
I know it sounds probably healthy, like, “That’s good. Move forward in life,” which is mostly true, but also, at the end of the day, if you can’t learn the lessons that you’re experiencing in life, you can’t become a better version through the difficulties you’ve overcome. I went back to school and onward through high school and college, started my own little business, and became a hospital chaplain. All of that was to prove to the world that I was enough because in my heart of hearts, I knew I wasn’t.
That is so huge. If somebody reading who’s running a company could sit with you for lunch or coffee, what would you tell them as they’re juggling all their responsibilities, and maybe they’re not seeing the main thing as the main thing or the most important thing as the most important thing? Maybe they’re too angry at their team. Maybe they’re wishing the market could be better. Maybe they’re a personal investor, and they wish they hadn’t invested in something that went south. What would you say if they said, “Your life seems to be focused on things that matter. It feels to me like I get upset about things that don’t matter.” What would you say to them?
I’m going to answer your question long-windedly. We are 39 for 39 when people interview us as a speaker for their organization, comparing us to other speakers. I promise you. I am going somewhere with this. Don’t hang up on me quite yet. You might be thinking, “What mighty stories do you share with these great executives and HR directors when you share with them your wisdom on why they should choose you versus X, Y, C, and everybody else they have access to?”
Why I think we are as successful, and because this gets back to your launch question, is when they jump on Zoom, I don’t tell them anything about me. I sit back and ask them about them, about their business, and then about their lives. I’m like, “You do a yearly conference. Why? In the past, what did success look like? What’s the theme this year? What are you looking to accomplish? If I see you at the end of it and you give me a hug and say, “John, this year was awesome because,” what would you say?”
The whole 29 minutes and 58 seconds is about me asking layup questions to them so I know their heart, their lives, what’s working, what’s not, and what success looks like. By the very end of it, they’re looking at their watches, thinking, “We’ve got our guy.” The reality is, I’ve told them nothing about their guy, nothing about the message, and nothing about the messenger. I’ve taken an interest in their life, in their work, and in things that matter to them.
The answer to your question with that story is if one of your executives says, “O’Leary, do you want to have lunch?” I would try to say yes, and they would probably leave there knowing less about my life than they did before they walked into that lunch meeting. As a hospital chaplain, you’re not trained to eulogize, evangelize, or motivate. You’re trained primarily to sit back, put your arm around someone, and listen. In other words, it sounds a lot like what Jesus did at the well.
I’m hopefully answering your question. We think, as executives, that we need to have the right words, the right strategy, the right tactics, and the right proforma all guiding us forward to the right results. There’s something powerful about having the right heart before you do any of the other stuff. At lunch, number one, they’re picking up the bill because I’m not doing it this time. They got all the words this time. Secondly, I would remind them to focus on the things that are eternal and that matter.
Most of the time, if you look at your life and look at the things that give you headaches, cause you to wake up in the middle of the night, and cause you to clench your fist and say, “Why would they vote for that? Why did she say that? Why that tweet?” If you can shut your eyes again and say, “Will it matter in six months?” Not universally, but almost always, the answer is no.
Ask yourself, “Would this matter in a decade? Will it matter to my grandchildren who I’m building this for in the first place?” Almost always, the answer is no. I try to remind friends, “Slow down, pray, and pause. Sit with people at the well and love them. Go more for relationships than results. If you pursue that doggedly, I promise you the results will follow.”
Slow down. Pray, pause, sit with people, dwell, love them. Value relationships over results. If you pursue that faithfully, the results will follow. Share on XI like it. You wrote a book. Is it Ignite? Is that right?
There have been three little books that I’ve rolled out. The first one by my mom and dad is called Overwhelming Odds. My dad with Parkinson’s disease and all these other struggles wrote this book. It became a bestseller. I wrote a book about ten years later called ON FIRE, and that rolled out into the marketplace. About eight years after that, we wrote a book called IN AWE. Those are the three books that are out there. The one that most people ask me about is ON FIRE, the middle one. That’s what they even did the film on. Soul on Fire, the movie, draws its inspiration from the book ON FIRE.
Seven Choices to Ignite a Radically Inspired Life is the ON FIRE book. Speak to leaders who are reading about maybe 1 or 2 principles from the 7. We won’t give them all seven. They can buy the book. What are a couple of things that you would say apply to CEOs running a company who are feeling pressure of juggling multiple priorities? They may be feeling like, “I can’t seem to figure out AI.” They’re struggling with faith integration. Their vice president quit. Speak to them with a couple of principles from the seven.
Lessons For Leaders: Humility, Gratitude, & Choice
How about I borrow one? These are lessons that my dad taught me. My dad is my favorite subject matter in the book. He is a masterful executive and a better human being. Those things usually are intertwined. They convene as one, typically. Two critically important lessons my father taught were the connection between humility when you have the world by the tail. The top-line revenue is beyond what you expected, and the bottom-line profitability is far greater than you imagined. All that stuff is working. You’re killing it.
My dad was never identified by what he was doing professionally. It was never him. He was grateful for the opportunity to serve. That was him when he was successful. Of his kids, I’m 1 of 6. I watched as all was taken away from him. Parkinson’s disease arrived on the scene. He was unable to drive, walk, move, speak, work, or earn. He lost everything financially.
Even in the midst of agony, in more ways than one, he was joyful in all things. He was humble and grateful. He was connected to those around him. He may have done his best work when he lost the ability to speak. It’s amazing how, when you talk too often, you use your mouth. My dad went about a decade without being able to, which means he could just listen, reflect, and give language through his eyes. I always wondered, “What did Jesus’ eyes look like?” I saw them in my Dad’s. They looked tender, wise, and loving.
I would share a little bit of that knowledge that my dad imparted to us. One way he lived was through a process of gratitude. I know this sounds like, “That’s so flighty and trippy. I don’t have time for this.” I implore your leaders to make time each morning to get into the word, sit in periods of pause, reflect on what it means in your life, and make a list of things that you’ve got that no market correction can take away from you.
I love that.
That’s key. My dad did that for his life and was grateful in every season. I would remind people of the power of that presence and choice. The second thing, using the word choice, is a story my dad taught me when I was ready to go back to school. This is about eighteen months in. I’ve been out for a while. I left this bushy-tailed, baseball-playing kid who is a class clown, and I’m coming back a year and a half later, still in a wheelchair, still struggling, and still unsure of who I am, whose I am, or what my life will look like.
I didn’t want any part of any of it. I kept asking my dad, “Why me, Dad?” Dad has answered this question a million times. This time, he answers it by standing up, walking toward the bedroom door, shutting the door, walking back toward me, kneeling down, putting his hands on my thighs, looking me in the eyes, and saying, “Why not you? This terrible thing has happened in your life. If you want to be a victim of it for the rest of your life, have at it. No one will blame you. You’ve been through the worst. You lost all your skin in that burn event.
You could roll into every room or, maybe one day, walk into every room as a victor. Every room you step into, people will look up in awe, not at what you overcome, but how you lead your life today.” He then said, “Victim or victor? Your choice.” My dad leans forward, kisses me on the cheek, stands back up, walks out of that room, and pulls the door shut. There’s a ten-year-old boy seated with some bandages on, fingers still missing, getting ready for school tomorrow morning, and trying to figure out which one.
People will look up in awe—not at what you overcame, but at how you live your life. Victim or victor—the choice is yours. Share on XThat choice is one I had to wrestle with as a fifth-grade kid, but it’s one your leaders need to wrestle with every day as markets correct or as employees say, “I know you hired me and overpaid me, but I’m out.” As spouses walk out, as children disappoint, as health scares show up, or as life happens, then what? Ultimately, you have agency. You can give it away to the president. You can give it away to AI. You can give it away to headlines or your neighbors who say, “It’s never been worse. Look at this.”
Like my dad, you could look East in the morning and watch the sunrise. You can take inventory of the things that no correction could ever take away from you, and you can get up and go after it. Your choice, not mine. Victim or victor? Those are a couple of key lessons from the book and two incredibly important lessons from my dad.
It’s incredible that God placed you in the family He did, potentially, in His sovereignty, understanding what would happen to you. Imagine if you were in a different family without this amazing father. It’s quite fascinating that you got to care for him.
Isn’t that the most ironic thing? There are two stories that I never share. The first is when he had his 2nd house fire, my mom and dad lost their home a 2nd time. Their son, who wanted to prove to the world that he was enough, became a carpenter and contractor. I was able to grab my tools and my crew, head out to my mom and dad’s house, and build it back at no cost to my mom and dad. It was the worst quarter on record for my little business back in the day, and it was the most meaningful work I’ve ever done, still. That’s cool. I got to build my childhood home.
The second thing is to lie with my dad as he is taking his last breaths, to be with him in this season of struggle, and to see his smile still on his face as a man who is grateful for all of life and for the next step into life. You brought up how blessed I am to enter into that family. I would imagine most of your readers either were born into a similar family or had a mentor in their life who stepped in and said, “There’s a better way to do life. Let me walk with you.”
For those of us who have received, and if you’re reading this, that is you. Do not kid yourself and say, “I built all this. That’s a lie. You haven’t.” We have. You’ve been blessed to have some influential people around you who’ve shown you the path forward. Thank God for them. Also, recognize that when walking in that path, your job is to look back and draw forward people who might need a hand or might need some encouragement. They might need a little bit of your wisdom, a little bit of your money, or a little bit of your time.
Rather than hoarding, our call is to give it back freely. I learned that from my dad, and I try to model it as a son. I speak at burn camps frequently, not just big organizations. My favorite work is for free in prisons and burn camps with individuals who did not have the family structure I do and did. I try to be that structure for them. I try to love them as Jesus loved us at the well.
That’s incredible. I’m reflecting on that Bible verse that talks about, “Let not the rich man save his riches, but let him who boasts boast in this, that he understands and knows me, that I’m the Lord who exercises justice and loving kindness on the earth.”
Drop the mic. Let’s go to the tattoo parlor and get that on the right bicep. It’s a beautiful gift of wisdom that we read over or hear, and then we move back to work. It’s like, “What do I need to do today, though? I did that pre-work good, but now I need to do real stuff.” What you said there’s the real stuff.
We’d be remiss if we didn’t talk about something happening on October 10th, 2025. Sony Pictures decided to make a movie out of your life. It’s going to be called Soul on Fire. Is that right?
It is right.
How can people find out about it and support it?
First of all, thank you. Where they can find out about it is to go to JohnOLearyInspires.com. That’s my name, JohnOLearyInspires.com. On that website, there’s a direct link to where you can learn and watch the film. We are booking theaters around the country and around the world. We’re booking them ahead of time, so you can have access to them up to two weeks ahead of time.
You can bring your team. You can bring the people you worship with or have dinner with ahead of time, which is super cool. Later on, if you want to take the kids or a couple of people you work with, you can go to the theaters in your community. We have links to all the places where that will be taking place. If you have any questions, you can email me. I’ll guide you through the process.
We’re trying to create a movement here for good. I spent a lifetime knowing I had no value. It was only because God kept walking forward with me and using other ordinary people, and some extraordinary, but most relatively typical, to keep guiding this little boy forward. With this movie, when people leave, they will recognize that heroes are alive and well. It’s not the kind you watch with Superman wearing tights and a cape, but in business owners, in admin, in spouses, in children, and in each of us. We’re called toward not just the greatness of the world, but also the greatness of serving. Join me. Go to JohnOLearyInspires.com and click the link to the site. Let’s go to the movie together.
That sounds great. I’ll be there. We’ll inform all of our Convene world that they should be there, too. We’re very grateful for your spending time with us. We look forward to our relationship continuing in the future.
I knew Convene when they were. I remember the good old days. You’ve grown since then. The best thing about your growth is not just the impact of that growth in the lives of those who are part of Convene, but the fact that you all recognize where it came from. It’s not just your incredible wisdom, your leadership, and the way you’ve guided this thing forward in a strategic plan. It’s the fact that God’s hand is over this, guiding it and us forward. We have that same conviction in our film. We have that same conviction in our business. I look forward to doing life with guys who are equally yoked. Thank you for your leadership. It clearly matters.
Thanks for being with us. We’ll look forward to seeing you surreptitiously on the screen on October 10th, 2025.
I look forward to it. I’ll wave.
I’ll see you later.
Important Links
About John O’Leary
John O’Leary, a husband and father of four, is a successful entrepreneur who has traveled the world. His life took an unexpected turn at age nine when a fire burned 100% of his body. Given a 1% chance to live, John chose to fight, enduring months in the hospital, dozens of surgeries, and years of physical therapy.
For two decades, John kept his story private until his parents published Overwhelming Odds, a book about their family’s experience that has sold nearly 100,000 copies. This led to John’s public speaking career, starting with three third-grade Girl Scouts and expanding to millions across 49 states and dozens of countries.
John is the #1 National Bestselling Author of On Fire: The 7 Choices to Ignite a Radically Inspired Life (2016) and In Awe: Rediscover Your Childlike Wonder to Unleash Inspiration, Meaning and Joy (2020). His story is also being released as a full-length feature film in Fall 2025. Through his work, John inspires others to embrace life as a sacred gift, choose their mindset, and believe in their power to change the world.
